VCA not saving settings Problem

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MattJW
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VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by MattJW »

Hi new here, (long time lurker) just been road testing Cubase 8 etc all very good but have noticed that the "Link Group Settings" for a VCA fader keep resetting to controlling Volume, Sends and Routing after saving and reopening a project.

So if i move an individual fader within a VCA group other faders in that group move as well. I.e. say i have a VCA group for drums if i then move the snare fader all the drum kit faders move. (this linking also applies to sends and routing). If i uncheck "volume" "Sends" and "Routing" in the VCA link Group Settings dialogue it all behaves as it should until i reopen the project then it resets as I described.

Be good to see if any one else has found this,

Matt
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by MattJW »

i've since found if i keep a minimum of one option checked in the Link Group Settings dialogue for example "Routing" it retains the setting when reloading a project

Matt
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by HughH »

MattJW wrote: the "Link Group Settings" for a VCA fader keep resetting to controlling Volume, Sends and Routing after saving and reopening a project.

So if i move an individual fader within a VCA group other faders in that group move as well.

Be good to see if any one else has found this,

Matt
Exactly the same thing happened to me tonight on day 2 of checking out 8.
Volume, Send, and Routing.

Took me a minute to find what the problem was.
And it IS a problem. I don't want to have to link ANYTHING else.

I wish they would COMPLETELY divorce the VCA function from the Link thing.

It just causes complications (Default Multi Record Arm and Multi Select in Mix Console - gotta use "Alt") and issues (this).

Hugh

PS I'm a really positive guy :D but with MCU issues and now this I'm getting cranky. Who Beta Tests this stuff? These issues are OBVIOUS . . .
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by 303Dan »

I'm seeing the exact same issue with VCA's. I reported it in the issues forum.

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HughH
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by HughH »

Wanted to bump this one time . . .

If anyone else could try this it would be apreciated - I want to create an Issue Report but want to make sure it's not something screwy in our systems (mine and MattJWs).

It's incredibly simple:

1. Open an empty project.
2. Add, say, 8 audio tracks.
3. Select 2 or 3 of them and Right Click on one of these and select "Create VCA Fader for Selected Channels".
4. Make sure that, in the "Edit Link Group Settings . . ." (accessible from the lower right down arrow on the top part of the VCA Fader and other places), ONLY "Use VCA Fader" is checked. This seems to default to several items checked (for no good reason I can think of . .).
5. Save the Project.
6. Open the Project.
7. Try moving ONE of the members of the VCA Group by itself (not the master).
Can you adjust it separately? Or do all the Groups faders move with it?
If it moves by itself - Post here and tell me I'm crazy.
8. If ALL the VCA Groups faders move together (wrong), open the "Edit Link Group Settings . . ." again (as above) and see what is now checked. In my case it's always Volume, Sends, and Routing.

Post here and let us know.

Many Many Thanks!

Hugh
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Puma0382 »

Confirmed - exactly as described in HughH's recipe. See sig for system detail.

Cheers,
Bob
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by fretthefret »

@Hugh

I have confirmed this exact behavior after saving and re-opening as you listed in your recipe on
Cubase Pro 8 on Windows 7 64 bit Ult.

You should post to ISSUES.
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by fretthefret »

Update to the ISSUE:

I have discovered the source of the issue...

When you deselect all items, SAVE, Close, Re-open

the Edit Link Group defaults are re-set and include Volume linking for the group (which sets the same fader position on all group members)

Defaults:
link_grp_1.png
The stock defaults when VCA fader is added
(45.83 KiB) Not downloaded yet
Edited settings:
link_grp_2.png
When all options are deselected before save and close
(45.52 KiB) Not downloaded yet
Settings automatically set after save and re-open
The previously deselected settings are automatically reselected and now include VOLUME linking.
link_grp_3.png
The Edit Link Group settings AFTER save and re-open
(49.55 KiB) Not downloaded yet
Last edited by fretthefret on Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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HughH
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by HughH »

Thanks, Everyone.

I posted to Issues.

Hugh
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by fretthefret »

HughH wrote:Thanks, Everyone.

I posted to Issues.

Hugh
Good find Hugh!

That one is a BIG Issue and should be added to the version 8 Known Issues ASAP. I'm a little surprised that one made it through the BETA Test !!??
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by MattJW »

Hi yes as i mentioned in my second post the work around is to select a minimum of one linked option that is the least troublesome, which for me was to pick "routing", then you can have all other links deselected then you can save and reopen a project without it reverting to the default state of volume, sends, routing being linked, but needs fixing asap.

Matt
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by xbitz2 »

yepp if at least one of the linking is enabled it's working otherwise it's falling back to the default state

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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by TSR »

EDIT: Sorry for confusion (I pulled the trigger too fast)

Please see my two next posts.
Last edited by TSR on Mon Dec 08, 2014 4:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by HughH »

TSR wrote:Why would you not use Volume with the VCA's?

My guess is that when leaving all out, the VCA's is "confused" and have NO clue, of what to do. And that's why they resets to the default IMO.

PS. Are there No One from Steinberg that could make a good manual, explainations and examples of the VCA's?
I believe you'll find that "Volume" create a volume "Link" group.
Similar to a VCA but by default all the faders move when you move one (Alt defeats this).
Several other differences.

Not the same.

Hugh
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by lukasbrooklyn »

HughH wrote:
TSR wrote:Why would you not use Volume with the VCA's?

My guess is that when leaving all out, the VCA's is "confused" and have NO clue, of what to do. And that's why they resets to the default IMO.

PS. Are there No One from Steinberg that could make a good manual, explainations and examples of the VCA's?
I believe you'll find that "Volume" create a volume "Link" group.
Similar to a VCA but by default all the faders move when you move one (Alt defeats this).
Several other differences.

Not the same.

Hugh
i'm not sure what it is you mean-- if you just wanted to link channels' inserts, for instance, a VCA wouldn't be needed. not saying i am against fixing what is clearly a bug, just curious to find out about people's VCA related workflows..
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by MattJW »

The great thing about the VCA fader is that it'll control all VCA grouped faders up and down as a group but you can still move the faders within the group independently of each other. Where as if the the linking check box marked "volume" is selected (by the bug) then moving one fader within the group will move all the others which defeats the purpose of VCA.
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by TSR »

I know VCA's ;)

I will look into it (a bit more).
IMO the VCA's should be completely independent of the regular Link options.
I do believe that they've had to use the Link options (behind the scenes) to be able to implement the VCA feature, which in that case is just a modified Link option.

I agree that from your description, it seems like a "bug", hmmmm :?
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by TSR »

The problem is that his is NOT a real VCA system.

It is the same old Link features with the possibility to add a fader. It shouldn't even be called a VCA fader IMO.
HughH wrote:Took me a minute to find what the problem was.
And it IS a problem. I don't want to have to link ANYTHING else.

I wish they would COMPLETELY divorce the VCA function from the Link thing.

It just causes complications (Default Multi Record Arm and Multi Select in Mix Console - gotta use "Alt") and issues (this).

Hugh

PS I'm a really positive guy :D but with MCU issues and now this I'm getting cranky. Who Beta Tests this stuff? These issues are OBVIOUS . . .
It took me two minutes ;)

And I am 100% agree on all accounts with HughH (and probably many others) on this.

PS. Have their Beta testers worked on a real VCA system? Hmmm :?
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Fredo »

As far as I am concerned, this is a bug.
Only -and only then- happens when you deselect all of the link options.

Fredo

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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by TSR »

The other problem is that when you select one of the tracks, it selects all. So it is NOT possible to distinguish between a Group (link) and VCA Group. These should be completely seperated IMO.

I see this as a Group/Link Master Fader, with an added Trim Automation possibility (like we always could've done from the Automation panel).
I don't wan't to select a track within a VCA group, with all other tracks being selected as well. Not good.

So with that "bug" out of the way, it could be handy in certain situations. But I hope they seperate the VCA feature completely from the Grouping/Linking system, making it closer to a "real" VCA fader/track system.
By mixing the VCA with the Groups/Links, it can fast become more complicated than necesarry IMO.

Please Steinberg, let as many seasoned VCA users test this as possible.
And listen, listen, listen to the feedback.
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Luis Dongo »

Hi guys,

the bug has already been reported by one of our product planners. I have moved the thread from the Issue Reports forum to the Collected Issues.

I'll keep you posted on the progress of fixing this issue.

Regards
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Pablo1980 »

Hi Luis, do this means that when I link several channels to a vca and then click on one of them, it doesn´t select all the tracks thus arming the record enable?

is that also a bug?

thanks1
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by TSR »

Pablo1980 wrote:Hi Luis, do this means that when I link several channels to a vca and then click on one of them, it doesn´t select all the tracks thus arming the record enable?

is that also a bug?

thanks1
I really hope so, that they differenciate between the Link/Group function and VCA's all together.

Anyway, we should be able to use VCA faders/tracks without the group functions all together.
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Freddie H
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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Freddie H »

I have problems adding other channels to already made VCA group if I not disable the whole VCA group first?
Example:

1. I have made a VCA-group called "Drums" and it include the channels = Kick, Snare, Hihat.

2. Now I want to add a new channel called "LOOP" to the same VCA-group "Drums".

3. I then select the channel, right click to add the "LOOP"-audio channel but I can't selected the VCA group "Drums"?

Very strange?
I will check the advance video again and see if I do something wrong?


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Re: VCA not saving settings Problem

Post by Outsounder »

It is a bit fiddly and ropey, especially the addition of "blank" VCA channels which pop up to the right of the console which are later bought into play by assigning links. IMO jus selecting a group and adding a VCA at the end of that selected group is far simpler and quick. I agree they should be divorced from the link channels control completely.
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