Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

For users of legacy Steinberg Cubase software
jpercival
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Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:06 pm

Hello all,
In [Device Setup/VST Audio System/Advanced Options] there is a box that says "Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme". If I check this box I get a dialog box, sort of a warning, about power consumption and so on. The last sentence in the box says "Further information on the Steinberg Audio Power Scheme can be found in the Steinberg Knowledge Base". However, a search of any combination of the words 'scheme', 'steinberg', 'audio', and 'power' yields no information on the subject from the Knowledge Base.

When I click 'OK' in the aforementioned box, I hear my CPU fan increase in speed (and volume). It continues to get incrementally louder over the next minute or two as I watch the CPU temp rise from the low 30's (C) to the low 50's. The volume of the CPU fan is inaudible without this box checked and too loud if I do. Also, that's a dramatic difference in operating temperature that I'm certain will shorten the life of my CPU.
As soon as I exit the software or uncheck the Steinberg Audio Power Scheme box, my CPU fan immediately drops to it's normal inaudible state and the CPU temp goes back to the low 30's.

However...In C5 the equivalent(?) box is labeled 'Disable CPU Energy Saving'. Checking it has none of the above described effects. Checking either of these boxes in their respective programs yields a less erratic result on the VST Performance meter...So, why can't I check this box in C6 without potential harm to my computer, and certainly a lot of fan noise even though I could check its equivalent in C5.

Steinberg, please provide some detailed documentation on this item, including how we can modify it's results. There's almost no information currently available.

Thanks,
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

Syncamorea
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Syncamorea » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:02 pm

Have you pulled up task manager while running the Power Scheme? It kinda sounds like it's running some sort of benchmark and loading your cores up. Look and see if all of your CPU cores are at 100%.
DAW #1 (mobile rig): MacBook Pro 2.8GHx, 8GB RAM, Logic Pro 9, Apollo Quad, UA 4-710d, Phoenix DRS-8, Grace m-201 AD.

DAW #2 (project studio): W7/64 PC: Intel i980x, Gigabyte UD-5, 3x2GB Mushkin DDR3 Redline, ATI 5770, Apollo Quad, Grace 904b, Phoenix Nicerizer 16, mucho outboard, Cubase 7, Wavelab 6.

Woodcrest Studio

Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Woodcrest Studio » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:07 pm

Jeff,

i have read around the net, and implemented it manually on my system, the always on full throttle power scheme.

From what I have read, this is what that check box does. And all that I have read is you can do the exact same thing manually and is usually recommended. Some settings are in the MB bios and some are within windows.

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:03 am

It's clear that at least one of the things the Steinberg Audio Power Scheme does is to shut of CPU core parking. From the research I've done, core parking seems to be a way that Windows 7 manages power consumption on multi-core machines. My CPU is a quad-core with 2 threads running per core. In task manager and resource monitor, this shows up as 8 cores. When I run C6 without the SAPS activated, the last 4 cores show a status of "parked". Various parking and un-parking happens during playback but nothing significant. However, if I activate SAPS, all cores remain un-parked at all times. I can see why this would greatly benefit the real-time processing needs of a DAW. I did a little research and found out that there is a registry modification that can be done to prevent Win7 from parking anything, ever. It's weird to me that there isn't a switch inside Windows somewhere that would just turn this feature off. I think I might try the registry fix anyway and see if that get's me some of what's good about SAPS without all the fan noise and excessive CPU temperatures.

However...I'd love it if Steinberg would be forthcoming (soon) about what Cubase says is true: That the Steinberg Knowledge Base contains information about SAPS. If any of you Steinberg folks read this, I'd love to learn some details about what SAPS does and how I can derive some of the benifits without the noise and cooling issues.

Thanks,
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

Guest

Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Guest » Wed Feb 16, 2011 2:41 am

I tried it on C5, seems the system already fans up and CPU and there's nothing I can do about it.

Konundrum
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Konundrum » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:01 pm

the thing that i don't understand is that the cpu gets hotter & the fan goes beserk which didn't happen in v5 but the asio hit is the same..

Guest

Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Guest » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:04 pm

C5 full CPU usage + full fan.

Don't know how to stop it (likely don't care) as it's a DAW not a game station.

Konundrum
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Konundrum » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:08 pm

you can stop it by turning off the steinberg power scheme..

i just want to know what's been changed since v5 & why..

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Guest » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:11 pm

On C5 you "opt in" don't know about C6.

I got a marginal reduction by changing to Power Conservation mode, better I guess.

Pity you can't change this stuff from within Cubase itself since if the program is going to create a power profile with default settings, why not be able to edit them as well without going into the control panel?

Woodcrest Studio

Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Woodcrest Studio » Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:09 pm

Brains wrote:On C5 you "opt in" don't know about C6.

I got a marginal reduction by changing to Power Conservation mode, better I guess.

Pity you can't change this stuff from within Cubase itself since if the program is going to create a power profile with default settings, why not be able to edit them as well without going into the control panel?
Better fan performance as far as fan speed could be a sacrifice to audio processing.

It is unlikely that Steinberg is going to give us an edit means. Whatever scheme they wrote should be fine for what they intend it to do: Have a reservoir of processing power sitting, waiting for a call to action verses a computer sitting at low idle that needs to be revved up to provide enough power, which potentially can cause dropouts or other issues related to it.

If your fan is bugging you, swap it out for one that is quieter. If this is solely a DAW and its in your mixing room, you have to adapt it one way or another.. Your own power scheme, quieter fan... If you achieve success without a "always on and full throttle" power profile, just leave it off.

Just be aware and keep track of, if you are in power conservation mode, what things the OS is throttling. Hard drives can go to sleep for instance which isn't good IMO. Processor spiking due to core parking may also occur.

I experienced the same full throttle fan. The only difference is I built and configured the system to be ready at full potential via the bios and windows settings when I built it. So I know what you are going through. I replaced the stock CPU fan and installed a couple of quiet case fans in insure proper ventilation to get around it. With laptops are hands are tied as far as fans go though..

This is what we get for having a PRO-DAW program! :mrgreen:

jpercival
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:37 pm

Konundrum wrote:you can stop it by turning off the steinberg power scheme..

i just want to know what's been changed since v5 & why..
Same here. I don't have the issue with 5, but I do with 6. I have very quiet case and CPU fans. As mentioned before, they are inaudible untile checking the 'Activate SAPS' box. The CPU fan is not the one that came with the processor. I added it to keep the machine quieter. Yes, I know, ironic. I just want to know more about the SAPS, or more accurately, about the difference between the power schemes in 5 and 6 so that I can get some of the perfomance boost without all the noise and heat.
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

JohnOnKeyz
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by JohnOnKeyz » Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:57 pm

I believe you can change a preference to not use the Steinberg power scheme, then you can build your own and set it as a default. I'm on on my studio comp right now, but it should be somewhere in the prefs. I won't be in the studio until tomorrow, but I'll check for it then and post back.

Apologize, I didn't see the former post. Looks like you've already found that. :D
John
(Maryland, USA)
~~~ the Aftereffekt ~~~ - - - - - | | | - - - - - ~~~ Slyd Studios ~~~

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by mkok » Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:07 pm

I have been scratching my head over this for the last few days as well.

I have a program called real temp and as soon as I open C6 it shows 70 Degrees and 100% load. ASIO does not show this and neither does task manager performance yet my temp is right up. C5 on real temp shows 13% CPU and 48 Degrees. Huge difference.

Everything works fine and my fan is also quiet. I would just like to know what is happening and what changed. Thats all simple really. Come on SB give us an answer. Is this a mistake/Bug or is it how it should work?
i7 960 18gb ram, Zoom LiveTrack L20, Genelc 1029a, Roland TD-30 ekit. SD3 Cubase and Wavelab always latest versions.Lots of other bits.

Konundrum
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Konundrum » Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:31 am

mkok wrote: I would just like to know what is happening and what changed. Thats all simple really. Come on SB give us an answer. Is this a mistake/Bug or is it how it should work?
yeah, i think this warrants a proper answer from the borgz.

i'm on a laptop at the moment and the temp/fan speed is unacceptable, i can put up with it near the end of a project when i need all available juice but all the time?? no way.. i've got the power scheme switched off & i'm using my own..i still wanna know what exactly has been changed since v5, something doesn't seem right if i'm getting the same asio performance but my computer is a LOT hotter & louder..

v5 had this nailed, surely something isn't right..

Konundrum
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Konundrum » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:32 pm

bump

jpercival
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:34 pm

bump
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

mkok
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by mkok » Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:48 pm

Well I disabled it and my pc is running glitch free nearly 25 degrees cooler. I still want to know what is going on here though?
i7 960 18gb ram, Zoom LiveTrack L20, Genelc 1029a, Roland TD-30 ekit. SD3 Cubase and Wavelab always latest versions.Lots of other bits.

Konundrum
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by Konundrum » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:30 am

mkok wrote:Well I disabled it and my pc is running glitch free nearly 25 degrees cooler. I still want to know what is going on here though?
+

jpercival
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Fri Feb 18, 2011 12:40 am

I also disabled SAPS, but I found out how to do at least a few of the system tweaks that it accomplished. I disabled CPU parking with the fix that can be readily found on the internet:

http://www.ultimatecomputers.net/forum/ ... f=7&t=3644

I also turned off any and all C-states including C1e in the BIOS. I also turned of Intel SpeedStep Tech. All this has had the effect of keeping all my cores unparked and at 100% of their set frequency...while keeping my CPU temp under 40(C).

Still wondering though...Hopefully we can get someone from Steinberg who knows the nitty gritty on this stuff to comment in this thread...or at least maybe they can put something in Knowledge Base about it.

Thanks,
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by dorremifasol » Sat Feb 19, 2011 7:09 pm

What I've found is that the new Power Scheme found in Cubase 6 improves the PCI latency a lot, and it also improves the efficiency on low latencies with multiple CPUs by a large amount. I'm using an RME Fireface 800 with a buffer of 64 samples only for real time playing.

Turning on the old option in Cubase 5 does not affect my system at all, if I'm running it with the default Windows full power scheme. Analyzing the PCI latency with PCI Latency checker shows no change (lots of spikes, maximum of 567us here, usually 250us). The ASIO performance monitor shows no improvement either. I suppose this option is only meant to disable any power saving feature you may have set for default in your system, without doing anything more.

However in C6, turning the option on, the PCI latency stabilizes incredibly,with a maximum of 230us and usually around 120. The ASIO performance monitor also reflects this. Of course it also sets the entire system to consume more power (I measured 10 watts more than using the default full power scheme). The option does what it says, improves stability with low latency settings and multiple CPUs, and makes the PC to consume more power. There is nothing broken, all the contrary, THIS IS GREAT! you can have more power and audio stability than any other way. I would like to know what's the improvement so I can use it to play games too :)

But, I wouldn't recommend turning this option ON if your system is not well refrigerated. Now I need a new CPU cooler!

Cheers,
Alberto
Attachments
C6 audio power scheme.png
PCI latency with Audio Power Scheme turned on
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PCI latency with Audio Power Scheme turned off
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Last edited by dorremifasol on Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Intel i5 750, Windows 7 64 bit, 16g RAM, Cubase 9, Halion 6, Wavelab 9.5 RME Fireface 802

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by rabdaddy » Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:55 pm

dorremifasol wrote:I wouldn't recommend turning this option ON if your system is not well refrigerated. Now I need a new CPU cooler!
Thanks for the info. Can't quite cipher whether your dead serious or exaggerating. Do you really need to upgrade your CPU cooler using the power scheme?
PCaudioLabs DAW - Win7 - Core i7-860 - Gigabyte P55 - 8gb Ram - Intel X25-M 160GB SATA2 SSD (OS) - 1TB SATA2 (audio) - 1TB SATA2 (samples) - Saffire Pro24 dsp - Cubase Pro 9 - / Dell 3650 - Win10 - Corei7 7600 - 16gb Ram - Samsung Evo 750 SSD 250gb (OS) - 2tb ext. (audio & samples) - UR44 - Cubase Pro 9

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dorremifasol
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by dorremifasol » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:05 pm

Well, in my case YES. My CPU (i5 750) has the stock cooler and is a piece of junk. I don't feel comfortable seeing the CPU reach more than 60ºC when using the Audio Power scheme.
Intel i5 750, Windows 7 64 bit, 16g RAM, Cubase 9, Halion 6, Wavelab 9.5 RME Fireface 802

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:16 am

dorremifasol wrote:What I've found is that the new Power Scheme found in Cubase 6 improves the PCI latency a lot, and it also improves the efficiency on low latencies with multiple CPUs by a large amount. I'm using an RME Fireface 800 with a buffer of 64 samples only for real time playing.
Alberto
Not sure if my results are the same as yours but I've certainly been able to increase my system performance by turning off CPU core parking in Win7 registry and turning of Intel SpeedStep and C-states in the BIOS. All this without the radical heat increase caused by SAPS.

That's why we need some kind of word from the Steinberg folks on exactly what the secret recipe for SAPS is. They should do this, first of all, because it says right there inside the application that we can find more information in the Steinberg Knowledge Base...nope, there's nothing there. Secondly, if a feature is going to put some systems in danger of overheating, as many of us have seen, we should be told what it's doing.

If we don't get some word soon, I guess we'll have to try email or phone. If I'm able to receive word back with some other method of communication, I'll post here what that information is.
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by sinewavz » Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:46 pm

I can't seem to find the option on my Mac, is this a windows option only?

jpercival
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Re: Activate Steinberg Audio Power Scheme

Post by jpercival » Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:26 am

I'm pretty sure that this is only on Windows 7
Jeff

STUDIO 1: Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / Windows 7 Pro 64 bit / Intel i7 860 running at 2.95Ghz /
Asus P7P55D Motherboard / 8 gigs PC-12800 DDR3 RAM / RME DSP Hammerfall (x2) /
ATI Radeon 4670 1gig DDR3 / 1920x1080(x2), 32 bit color

STUDIO 2: Nuendo 3.2.1 / Cubase 6.0.3 / Sonic Foundry CDA 5.2 / Windows XP Pro SP3 /
AMD 64 x2 6000+ am2 / Asus M2V Motherboard / 4 gigs RAM / RME Hammerfall /
NVIDIA GeForce 7100 GS / 1600x900, 32 bit color

OFFICE: Windows 7 64 bit / Sony Vaio (laptop) / Intel Core 2 Duo T7500 (2 x 2.2 GHz) /
4 gigs RAM / Cubase 7.0.4 64 bit / RME Multiface via Express Card

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