High-DPI support in Cubase? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GUI)

Post general topics related to Cubase Pro 9, Cubase Artist 9 and Cubase Elements 9 here.
MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

High-DPI support in Cubase? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GUI)

Post by MT_ »

Does Cubase 9 support HiDPI (High DPI, Retina)?
I cannot find anything about HiDPI in the official texts and the trailer video.

Thanks.
Last edited by MT_ on Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Ed Doll
Site Admin
Posts: 1245
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 11:18 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by Ed Doll »

Unfortunately not. We are still working on that but there is no information available when this will be supported.
Ed Doll, Support Manager
Steinberg Media Technologies GmbH
Hamburg, Germany

Connect with Steinberg on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Instagram and SoundCloud!

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

Thanks, Ed. That’s incredibly disappointing. Steinberg is still working on this for at least two years already.

Doesn’t Cubase 9 at least provide non-blurry scaling by pixel duplication, so that Windows’ users wouldn’t suffer too much?
Last edited by MT_ on Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Ed Doll
Site Admin
Posts: 1245
Joined: Thu May 16, 2013 11:18 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by Ed Doll »

There is no change compared to Cubase 8.x unfortunately.
Ed Doll, Support Manager
Steinberg Media Technologies GmbH
Hamburg, Germany

Connect with Steinberg on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, Instagram and SoundCloud!

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

Oh, cograts to Steinberg: they have just released an a-priori outdated product.

It’m unfortunately going to look closer at existing HiDPI-capable alternatives such as FL Studio and Studio One.

Ed, could you clarify what exactly is the issue with HiDPI support in Cubase: programming vector-based GUI or creating vectorized versions of GUI elements for Cubase? (For what it’s worth, I could help with creating vector graphics.)

Thanks.

Pablo1980
Member
Posts: 302
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 4:54 pm
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by Pablo1980 »

Ed, please let me say that I appreciate your present here., but this update is extremely disappointing

A lot of bugs still present, no retina, we still have unresolved issues and you are not addressing them.

why trying so hard with the cloud, and don't implement real changes that could make a composer's lives easer

You are not a developer but please convey our concern about the direction steinberg is so stubbornly taking.
Film Composer - Argentina

Intel 9990k - Gigabyte Aorus Pro Z390 - 64gb ram - Motu 24ao - Steinberg MR816x (2)
Windows 10.5 64bit - Cubase 10.5 Pro - Vepro 7 (two add PCs)

User avatar
Dagga78
New Member
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:40 pm
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by Dagga78 »

Wow... just....wow... You have been working on retina display support for two years and STILL nothing. This is pretty amazing actually...
I am disappointed with this one for sure...

Lost for words :(
Imac 27" 2017
4.2GHZ QC i7.
64gb 2400MHZ DDR4
ADM RADEON PRO 580 W/8GB VRAM

Macbook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2014)
2,5 GHz Intel Core i7
16 BG 1600 MHz DDR3
NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M 2048 MB
Intel Iris Pro 1536 MB

Nuendo 6.5
Cubase Pro 8.5
Cubase Pro 9.0.1
Cubase Pro 9.0.20
Cubase Pro 10.0.5.72

ikarus75
New Member
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 6:23 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by ikarus75 »

I need to echo on this thread.

First, congratulations Team Steinberg on the release of Cubase Pro 9. I'm a Cubase SX, 4, 5.5, 7, 7.5, 8, and 8.5 user. There are many excellent new features. However, I got as far as entering a credit card at checkout and decided not to proceed today. Here's why...

I was surprised when Version 8.5 launched without HiDPI last year. But, I still bought it. I was naturally waiting for Cubase Pro 9 to launch this week, and eagerly went through the feature list to check for HiDPI support. I'm actually shocked it's not there this time, and I don't use that word often.

I've had a Dell Precision laptop for 2.5 years with 3200 x 1800 resolution. Cubase looks crappy on it. Windows 10 is 17 months old, and MacOS with Retina support is much older than that. I can't imagine that redrawing and programming the assets at 200% and 300% is a huge issue – vector or raster.

Needless to say, having a clean sharp visual interface is a high priority for my audio production, and I would consider HiDPI to now be in the "NECESSARY" category. I don't know that I will buy Cubase Pro 9 if support isn't added as a free update in the next six months.

All the best.

User avatar
StrangeDaysOnEarth
Junior Member
Posts: 99
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2014 9:36 am
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by StrangeDaysOnEarth »

Awful news!
website: www.strangedays.earth
soundcloud: www.soundcloud.com/strangedaysonearth
facebook: www.facebook.com/strangedaysonearth
itunes: www.itunes.apple.com/strangedaysonearth

| iMac 5K 27" 4.2GHz i7, 24GB RAM, 1TB SSD | LaCie RAID |
| Mac OSX.13.6 | Cubase 10.0.10 | Wavelab Pro 9.0.3 | Halion 5.1.1 |
| CMC-TP | CMC-QC | Steinberg UR22 | RME FF400 | MOTU Midi Express 128 |

User avatar
ShikiSuen
Member
Posts: 547
Joined: Thu Mar 08, 2012 2:47 am
Location: Edogawa, Tōkyō, Japan
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by ShikiSuen »

Dagga78 wrote:Wow... just....wow... You have been working on retina display support for two years and STILL nothing. This is pretty amazing actually...
I am disappointed with this one for sure...

Lost for words :(
Pablo1980 wrote:Ed, please let me say that I appreciate your present here., but this update is extremely disappointing

A lot of bugs still present, no retina, we still have unresolved issues and you are not addressing them.

why trying so hard with the cloud, and don't implement real changes that could make a composer's lives easer

You are not a developer but please convey our concern about the direction steinberg is so stubbornly taking.
MT_ wrote:Oh, cograts to Steinberg: they have just released an a-priori outdated product.

It’m unfortunately going to look closer at existing HiDPI-capable alternatives such as FL Studio and Studio One.

Ed, could you clarify what exactly is the issue with HiDPI support in Cubase: programming vector-based GUI or creating vectorized versions of GUI elements for Cubase? (For what it’s worth, I could help with creating vector graphics.)

Thanks.
Read this: viewtopic.php?f=250&t=107407
// My first name is Shiki. A trilingual Chinese living in Japan.
My nationality doesn't prove anything, but I do have little issues with nuances in written English.
PRC出身の孫志貴と申します。三つ言語話せます。ここで国籍は何にも証明できませんが、英語のニュアンスには少し苦手です。
[ZOOM UAC-2] [MDR-7506] [Studio One 4.5] [Dorico Pro 3] [macOS Catalina] [Mac Pro 2013] [MacBook Pro 15" 2017]

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

ikarus75 wrote:Windows 10 is 17 months old
Moreover, I use Windows 7 (released more than 7 years ago) at zoom of 200%, and it’s perfectly usable. The only serious issue was that lengths of address bar and search box in Windows Explorer had incorrect proportions, but I’ve worked around this bug myself by writing a small utility named ExplorerHiDpiFix. An extra minor issue was that Windows 7 has mouse cursors intended for maximum zoom of 150%, but cursors for 200% can easily be borrowed from Windows 10.
ikarus75 wrote:I don't know that I will buy Cubase Pro 9 if support isn't added as a free update in the next six months.
I was also seriously intending to buy Cubase 9 as long as it supported HiDPI (I am a 4K monitor owner for more than 1.5 years already). But looks like Cubase is now a completely closed chapter for me, I’m unable to wait for another two years just to see that the next version is again released with no HiDPI support. Steinberg is apparently detached from reality, and that’s unlikely going to change.
Last edited by MT_ on Thu Dec 08, 2016 5:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.

VHProductions
New Member
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2016 7:44 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by VHProductions »

Just a thought... but perhaps the expected "new Video Engine" expected to arrive for C9 in March will integrate HiDPI Support? Some details regarding the expected video engine would be appreciated and may assist with those still up in the air about upgrading.

Cheers

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

VHProductions wrote:perhaps the expected "new Video Engine" expected to arrive for C9 in March will integrate HiDPI Support?
As far as I know, video engine is related to decoding/playing videos and has nothing to do with UI graphics engine.

User avatar
theRoyal1
Member
Posts: 505
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2011 5:08 pm
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by theRoyal1 »

MT_ wrote:
ikarus75 wrote:Windows 10 is 17 months old
Moreover, I use Windows 7 (released more than 7 years ago) at zoom of 200%, and it’s perfectly usable. The only serious issue was that lengths of address bar and search box in Windows Explorer had incorrect proportions, but I’ve worked around this bug myself by writing a small utility named ExplorerHiDpiFix. An extra minor issue was that Windows 7 has mouse cursors intended for maximum zoom of 150%, but cursors for 200% can easily be borrowed from Windows 10.
ikarus75 wrote:I don't know that I will buy Cubase Pro 9 if support isn't added as a free update in the next six months.
I was also seriously intending to buy Cubase 9 as long as it supported HiDPI (I am a 4K monitor owner for more than 1.5 years already). But looks like Cubase is now a completely closed chapter for me, I’m unable to wait for another two years just to see that the next version is again released with no HiDPI support. Steinberg is apparently detached from reality, and that’s unlikely going to change.
I thought I was the only one with the issue on the bar...

I am currently using C9 on my 4k monitor @ 175% Zoom and think I have fallen in love with the view... Yes, there are a few issues that were initially there but once I settled on this setting and re-opened it. It looks fantastick. The VST's look amazing in their new size too...

I've done some color scheme adjustments and am setting up some templates.. I'm gonna try and transfer settings..I hope I don't muck it up..lol

:geek:
Custom WS: i7 3930k | Corsair H100 | Sapphire HD7950 Dual X | 64GB Patriot Viper III DDR3 1866 | MSI BigBang XPower II | 8xSamsung EVO=12TB + 2xWD4001=8TB HDD | Enermax 1200w 80+ Platinum | CM Cosmos II
Cubits : Cubase 10.5.12b123
CMC-TP | CMC-CH | CMC-PD | CMC-AI | 2xCMC-FD | CMC-QC

Main Gear: Access Virus Ti + Virus C | Maschine Studio + Jam | Korg Triton pro 76 | Novation SL MKII | Roland XV-5080 + JV-2080 | Goliath HD | Barefoot MicroMain27 Gen2 | Mackie HR824 | Yamaha AW4416 | MOTU MidiXT | Roland TR-8, TB-3, VT-3 | Seiki SE50UY04

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Is Cubase 9’s GUI small or blurry?

Post by MT_ »

theRoyal1 wrote:I am currently using C9 on my 4k monitor @ 175% Zoom and think I have fallen in love with the view...
I heard Cubase 8 was false-DPI-aware and therefore its GUI was undisableably small in HiDPI modes under Windows. Is that the case with Cubase 9, or it has normal size and is blurry like any other non-DPI-aware application? Thanks.

User avatar
theRoyal1
Member
Posts: 505
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2011 5:08 pm
Contact:

Re: Is Cubase 9’s GUI small or blurry?

Post by theRoyal1 »

MT_ wrote:
theRoyal1 wrote:I am currently using C9 on my 4k monitor @ 175% Zoom and think I have fallen in love with the view...
I heard Cubase 8 was false-DPI-aware and therefore its GUI was undisableably small in HiDPI modes under Windows. Is that the case with Cubase 9, or it has normal size and is blurry like any other non-DPI-aware application? Thanks.
Not blurry at this setting but not HiDPI sharp either.

The difference is obvious. The GUI are much Cleaner and everything looks neat.
For me the biggest issue in 8.5 was the top bar drop downs not lining up. The Max I could set it was 125%. Many of the GUI's didn't scale so you had smaller VST's and fonts.. It was difficult to work but I plowed through.

So far, this is the best I've seen Cubase ever look and with my custom colors...I'm very happy.

:geek:
Custom WS: i7 3930k | Corsair H100 | Sapphire HD7950 Dual X | 64GB Patriot Viper III DDR3 1866 | MSI BigBang XPower II | 8xSamsung EVO=12TB + 2xWD4001=8TB HDD | Enermax 1200w 80+ Platinum | CM Cosmos II
Cubits : Cubase 10.5.12b123
CMC-TP | CMC-CH | CMC-PD | CMC-AI | 2xCMC-FD | CMC-QC

Main Gear: Access Virus Ti + Virus C | Maschine Studio + Jam | Korg Triton pro 76 | Novation SL MKII | Roland XV-5080 + JV-2080 | Goliath HD | Barefoot MicroMain27 Gen2 | Mackie HR824 | Yamaha AW4416 | MOTU MidiXT | Roland TR-8, TB-3, VT-3 | Seiki SE50UY04

pulpfiction
Junior Member
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 2:48 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by pulpfiction »

Look on the bright side, Well at least thats saved me an extra $100 US this christmas

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: Is Cubase 9’s GUI small or blurry?

Post by MT_ »

theRoyal1 wrote:Not blurry at this setting but not HiDPI sharp either.
I’m not sure I understand correctly what you mean. Could you provide a screenshot of Cubase 9 running on your system?

User avatar
fenderchris
Senior Member
Posts: 1492
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 2010 7:30 pm
Location: Planet Palmer
Contact:

Re: Is Cubase 9’s GUI small or blurry?

Post by fenderchris »

MT_ wrote:
theRoyal1 wrote:Not blurry at this setting but not HiDPI sharp either.
I’m not sure I understand correctly what you mean. Could you provide a screenshot of Cubase 9 running on your system?
How have you increased the size of Cubase and the plugins on W7?

I have been unable to increase the size of Nuendo on my system with a 4k screen.
Chris

The Archers - give it a rest already!

OS: Windows-10 Pro 64-bit v.1903.
PC: i7 Quad core 2.66GHz, 24GB ram, SSD drives.
Screens: LG 4K 3440x1440, AG-Neovo 1280x1024 (x2).
Hardware: RME FireFace UFX, MR816CSX (x2), SmartAV Tango-1 + 12-fader expansion, MOTU Midi Express 128, UAD-2 Quad, Lexicon PCM-91, Lexicon MPX-550, TC-Fireworx, Roland V-Drums TD-20X, Nektar Panorama P1.
Software: Nuendo-8.1.10, Wavelab-Elements-9.5, Halion-6, Halion Sonic 3, Kontakt-5, Cubase iCPro for iPhone and Android (killed by its parents at birth), Omnisphere, Trillian.

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: Is Cubase 9’s GUI small or blurry?

Post by MT_ »

fenderchris wrote:How have you increased the size of Cubase and the plugins on W7?
I have been unable to increase the size of Nuendo on my system with a 4k screen.
Your question is probably for theRoyal1. AFAICT, given that it is officially confirmed that Cubase 9 still does not support HiDPI, Cubase 9 should have correct size while being blurry due to bilinear or bicubic scaling that Windows applies to any non-DPI-aware application.

By the way, based on Mac screenshots, Mac users are somewhat more lucky than Windows users — Cubase 8.5+ for macOS at least provides quality rendering of text, envelope curves, and rounded corners of panels like Inspector.

ikarus75
New Member
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2016 6:23 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by ikarus75 »

Rereading what I wrote – I think I misunderstood the complexity of reformatting for HiDPI screens. I didn't consider all the interactive GUIs for individual plugins, particularly 3rd party ones. I would assume that in the future, the new Plugin Sentinel will also function to block plugins that are disrupting graphic performance (fps) or causing havoc in HiDPI modes.

That said, I believe HiDPI and interpolated elements can co-exist. An example would be Kontakt 5.6 within Vienna Ensemble Pro 6.

I know there are hard working people that have been determined to make Cubase Pro 9 a worthy upgrade. Some of the new features are genuinely compelling.

HiDPI is still a significant issue for me. It is understandable that audio developers have not focused on this because - it doesn't affect the quality of the audio. With desktop monitors, I'm running 100% scaling at 1080p/1200p, so this isn't an issue. My laptop screen is a different beast, as is any future upgrades to 4K monitors. HiDPI/Retina displays are one of the biggest changes in the Windows and Mac ecosystem. I believe the advantages outweigh the drawbacks, and it's something developers should embrace as quickly as possible. In software environments where stability is paramount, I recognize this may not be easy.

I still don't know when/if I'll make the upgrade.

fretthefret
Member
Posts: 385
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:29 am
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by fretthefret »

MT_ wrote:
ikarus75 wrote:Windows 10 is 17 months old
Moreover, I use Windows 7 (released more than 7 years ago) at zoom of 200%, and it’s perfectly usable. The only serious issue was that lengths of address bar and search box in Windows Explorer had incorrect proportions, but I’ve worked around this bug myself by writing a small utility named ExplorerHiDpiFix. An extra minor issue was that Windows 7 has mouse cursors intended for maximum zoom of 150%, but cursors for 200% can easily be borrowed from Windows 10.
ikarus75 wrote:I don't know that I will buy Cubase Pro 9 if support isn't added as a free update in the next six months.
I was also seriously intending to buy Cubase 9 as long as it supported HiDPI (I am a 4K monitor owner for more than 1.5 years already). But looks like Cubase is now a completely closed chapter for me, I’m unable to wait for another two years just to see that the next version is again released with no HiDPI support. Steinberg is apparently detached from reality, and that’s unlikely going to change.

MT, I'm on LG 4K monitors to my GeForce GTX 1070 and Cubase 9.0.1 looks perfect at 4K.
Some plugins, not so much, but that is not a Cubase problem and the Windows Magnifier can help for quickly viewing the non-vector, non-scaling third-party gui (**ahem** cough** WAVES!!)
Cubase Pro 10.5, FL Studio 20, Ableton Live Suite 10.1,Harrison Mixbus 32c, UAD Apollo x series, UR44, UR28m, SSL, Native Instruments Komplete ultimate, NI Maschine Studio, Xfer Records Serum, Lennar Digital Sylenth1, reFx Nexus3, Reveal Sound Spire, FabFilter, Soundtoys, Lexicon PCM, Sonarworks, Slate Digital, Izotope, Brainworx, SPL, Waves, Cableguys, Cytomic, MeldaProductions, AOM, IK Multimedia, DDMF, Boz Digital, Antares Autotune, a bunch of other obscure stuff, TBs of samples, too much hardware to list... PC Windows 10 Pro 64bit, i7-5960x (8 core), Asus x99 Deluxe ii, GeForce 1070 strix, Fractal Design Silent RL2 case, Noctua NH-d15s, 64 GB DDR4 g,Skillz Trident Z 3200 RAM, 1tb Samsung 960 m.2, 3TB segate Ironwolf NAS HDD, 4TB WDRed, 2TB WD Black, Laptop: MSI Ghost pro GS60 6QE i7-6700 Skylake Win 10 64bit, Storage: 32 TB QNAP NAS Raid 50, 12 TB QNAP RAID 1

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

fretthefret wrote:I'm on LG 4K monitors to my GeForce GTX 1070 and Cubase 9.0.1 looks perfect at 4K.
1. Have you forced HiDPI mode via executable’s properties (so GUI should be tiny) or GUI is blurry (it’s inevitably blurry for all non-DPI-aware applications under Windows)?

2. Could you share a screenshot of Cubase 9 running on your system? (PNG format is recommended.)

3. What is the inch size of your 4K monitor?

Thanks.

P.S. You don’t have to quote the entire message you’re replying to. Quoting just a small, most relevant part is generally enough and makes it easier to read and navigate. ;-)
Last edited by MT_ on Fri Dec 09, 2016 7:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

MT_
Junior Member
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2016 11:17 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by MT_ »

ikarus75 wrote:HiDPI and interpolated elements can co-exist. An example would be Kontakt 5.6 within Vienna Ensemble Pro 6.
Sure, running non-DPI-aware plugins in a DPI-aware DAW can be easily achieved (at least in Windows) by implementing VST host as a separate application, so that Windows could apply DPI scaling to the VST host independently from the DAW itself.

I have successfully tested this in Reaper forced to run in HiDPI mode (using a modified application manifest) and running a non-DPI-aware plugin in a separate/dedicated process.

Moreover, running plugins in separate processes is essentially the only way to protect DAW from crashing together with a crashed plugin. Just autodisabling plugins that sometimes crash is a weak lazy workaround, not a solution.

Johnny
New Member
Posts: 48
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:46 pm
Contact:

Re: High-DPI support in Cubase 9? (HiDPI, Retina, scaling GU

Post by Johnny »

Think this is a real shame. We are 4 years on from retina mac-books and I really expected significant improvements (if not full retina everywhere) from C9.

Sigh!

John

Post Reply

Return to “General”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests